Thanks Krom for enhancing Warrior a little, particularly for non-primes. Note for Warrior primes not too happy with their lot at the moment, this is apparently designed as a first set of adjustments, so to me that infers more is coming..
For those who missed it, here’s the basics (correct me if I’m wrong):
[b:1bpyfwwx]For Warrior primes :[/b:1bpyfwwx]
frenzy duration increased a bit at higher levels (mine at 5x40 is now 90 seconds)
frenzy now adds damage to non-melee attacks as well (backstab, deathgrip, deathtouch, wraithtouch, strike and circlestab) at ~50% of what its regular damage bonus is.
berserk now adds damage to non-melee attacks, but at roughly 2x the rate of frenzy (still has 2.0ac penalty though).
[b:1bpyfwwx]For Warrior non-primes :[/b:1bpyfwwx]
small boost to melee damage (physical attacks, not kick, backstab etc).
frenzy duration increased a bit at higher levels.
frenzy now adds damage to non-melee attacks as well (backstab, deathgrip, deathtouch, wraithtouch, strike and circlestab) at ~50% of what its regular damage bonus is.
berserk now adds damage to non-melee attacks, but at roughly 2x the rate of frenzy (still has 2.0ac penalty though).
minimum hp bonuses at tertiary and quad levels. For tertiary you will never get less than 4 hp (not much different than now), for quad you will not receive less than 2 hp per level.
So there you have it. For primes, the main thing is the frenzy stab bonus imho. Substantial improvements for non-prime Warriors. Also may make Thief primes think again about excluding warrior from their classo, although yet to ascertain just how much an improvement it is.. stabbed a couple of mobs and little apparent difference, but too soon to tell really.
I have never used berserk because for some reason you cant get a critical hit when berserk is up. So frenzy much better, even from a damage perspective.
Has this changed?
I have never used berserk because for some reason you cant get a critical hit when berserk is up. So frenzy much better, even from a damage perspective.
Has this changed?[/quote:21em802n]
True Berserk is hindered by -2 ac and no critical hits.
When I was testing it with Dogs both skills averaged out almost the same. Frenzy did less melee dmg but got critical hits which brought the avg up. There should not be a double penalty here.
It would be pretty good to get critical hit to work with berserk. Was this
a bug that was over looked?
Mikey now has a very strong gripper, since bersek helps grip/touch.
I thought you had to be engaged to berserk. No?
Nope, you can berserk whenever, I do it before shifting all the time.
Krom will the frenzy / berserk damage bonus apply to broadside & flail too please?
Krom will the frenzy / berserk damage bonus apply to broadsword & flail too please?[/quote:1erpoed4]
At this point i wanted to make a correction about skill name being Broadside, not Broadsword (which is an item), but honoring our agreement i will NOT do it.
:roll:
Ill take a look and see what we think.
When we get done taking a look, can we scatter some of our tokens for those pesky mortals? :?
Ill take a look and see what we think.[/quote:3fhfj1ej]
:shock: are you turning schitzo on us?
melee damage could be low, but it is noticeable.
Now i can brutally with berserk :)
thanks Krom
Krom have you considered yet adding the frenzy / berserk damage bonus to broadside (and I guess flail if anyone uses it)? Seems kinda weird having a Warrior skill improvement that mostly applies to Warrior non-primes.
How bout fixing charge to be useful? Currently theres a full round of lag and the cleric supps that are mounts dont do anything useful like autoassist while riding.
Making qilin something more than just a horse would be useful. Perhaps it autoassisting on a charge and doing the peri cure proc while mounted.
I agree with Zukt..
this lag annoy.
Why add it if charge anyway far weaker then stab/grip?
It is even weaker then 2 bolts for me
Krom have you considered yet adding the frenzy / berserk damage bonus to broadside (and I guess flail if anyone uses it)? Seems kinda weird having a Warrior skill improvement that for the most part applies to Warrior non-primes.[/quote:3blpbh3m]
bump
bump … again.. warrior skill.. currently benefits warrior primes the [b:3iqvl9uf]least[/b:3iqvl9uf].. (relative to warrior elsewhere in classo).. effects backstab, deathgrip, deathtouch, wraithtouch, strike and circlestab, but not broadside and flail, even though those are the two warrior skills and the others are not??? ..makes little to zero sense ..please can this apply to broadside and flail, considering this is supposed to be a warrior skill…. :shock:
Why does this thread always get bumped when Krom posts to the board?
:twisted:
nudge weasel
Weasel wrote: Krom have you considered yet adding the frenzy / berserk damage bonus to broadside (and I guess flail if anyone uses it)?
Berserk always worked well with Stabs. I would double-stab with berserk sometimes, a primary reason I missed stabs all the time. Berserk lags, also why I was -8 or -7 at times, instead of -10.0 (+26 damage +18 stabdam +18 hit).
I believe that the best warrior skill is still toss. That you can toss a Monk with slowfall down the idol, or the chasm in cano or the clouds… it’s great. Slowfall doesn’t work over Toss, and if it does there’s another Monk skill needing nerfed, real bad. It bothers me to the point of just making your characters lives living hell because of not just letting me play anymore. I was p-worded because Yinao is obviously out of his blinking mind… and I’ve been sober for six months. Keep calling me out Yasik2, probably a clone of a cloned Russian, isn’t Yasik russian? So you’re double-yasik? Are you 1/8th Yasik’s size? Cause he is uhm, wel who knows he’s Russian, I’ve never been to Russia so maybe they’re like the Nordic and Vikings of Old, you know 9 feet tall. I’d imagine at an 8th of nine feet would make you around 4 foot 2. In fact, no more than what’s left you’d be at that point something more the to sound of …1/8 * (912) - (412+2) = your height, in brain cells. A little of each I think as well, that you’ve got the brain-cells for your own personal height… that’s just great Yasik2 (s). I think that means you’ve got a scientifically negative notation of thoughts. It basically (if I must be so kind to elaborate) means you’re an asshole. Take care guys, I mean all of you.
Stupid Jerk from Kentucky….
What are peoples thoughts so far on using the tumbling skill as tank? Has anyone tried to figure out how much damage it reduces?
bump … again.. warrior skill frenzy / berserk.. currently benefits warrior primes the [b:2rr477ya]least[/b:2rr477ya].. (relative to warrior elsewhere in classo).. effects backstab, deathgrip, deathtouch, wraithtouch, strike and circlestab, but [i:2rr477ya]not[/i:2rr477ya] broadside and flail, even though those are the two warrior skills and the others are not??? ..makes little to zero sense having a warrior skill that warrior primes don’t benefit from, but other classes do benefit from.. in fact that makes it anything but a warrior skill! So.. please can frenzy/berserk apply to broadside and flail, considering this is supposed to be a warrior skill…. :shock:
or else make it a thief skill or something, and then create a warrior skill for ..wait for it.. warriors!
damn hijackers :P
any point even trying to bump this again?
how come you cant get -11 anymore, just 10-12?
help heavy
“HEAVY ARMOR PROFICIENCY”
Level: Warrior 38
Manual: an armor-plated manual
Only those who have been trained in the proper use of very heavy armor
can fully utilize its protective power. This skill represents a level
of competency in heavily armored combat. Without this proficiency, the
maximum achievable armor class is -10. However, with this skill any
warrior can achieve -11. [b:2x37thid]For the truly devoted warrior prime with
this skill, there is no limit to the armor class that can be reached
(with the right equipment)[/b:2x37thid]
sarcasm?:)
Broad side already does massive critical hits fairly often and has a possibility of stunning the mob, preventing it from doing a special procedure. Your gripe is that frenzy doesn’t stack onto it? How do you know it doesn’t? The bonus is so small there’d be no way for us to even tell. I’m not saying it shouldn’t stack. Just wondering how you know it doesn’t.
Edit: if someone does go into frenzy / berserk and work on it, I’d like a room msg on success please. Weasel works himself into a frenzy and foams at the mouth, or something along those lines. So the leader will know the tank just lagged his or herself for a few secs.
I asked back when it was introduced - can’t even recall which coder it was now - but was advised by the implementer as I already mentioned:
(add on: I believe it was Krom - see the original post on this thread.)
This ‘warrior’ skill effects backstab, deathgrip, deathtouch, wraithtouch, strike and circlestab, but [i:b1kglkxp]not[/i:b1kglkxp] broadside or flail, even though those are the two warrior prime skills and all the others are not.
This was introduced as [i:b1kglkxp]part[/i:b1kglkxp] of an attempt to add some warrior abilities as they are lacking relatively speaking, but IMHO this possibly should not be classed as a warrior skill the way it stands, but perhaps (yet another) thief one if anything, which still leaves warrior primes behind.. Granted it does help players who have warrior in their classo, just not so much primes, which I was given the impression it was intended to help warrior primes.
Whatever, just call me a whiner. I’m rolling a prime thief now, so I expect they’ll be nerfed soon enough, muahahaha!
When I see this :
shifted 2300hp, -12ac, 7 attacks @ +26dam
I seriously think it’s time to consider retiring my character - the warrior prime class (particularly old school classo) might as well not exist anymore.
Feel free to flame.
flame.
Necro’s take it a step further than me weasel… trust me on that. Might I add with weapon damage and the ability to heal self, and run without shift costs… there is not too much difference… when you consider how much faster it is too level a warrior than a one attack druid.
Your char is somewhat inbetween being big and getting xp faster, while mine is bigger and gets xp slower. My damage is superceeded by a warrior with cap weapon damage, so all I’m left with is more hp and two attacks before I flee to waste even more mana healing up and reshifting… Your class is now bad, deal with it… I did, I made App.
You wanna see shimbo in action… I bet he dishes more damage than I do.
[quote:ywgfmjyv]A run consists of me using 900 mana shifted (2300hp, -12ac, 7 attacks @ +26dam) [/quote:ywgfmjyv]
You left out the mana!!!!
No worries….I feel a druid nerfing coming :D
Might I also point out my mana is actually only 670. I’ve made a max mana mode to get my 900. It’s called working hard… being a dumb warrior your regen is probably a pearl of the rising tide.
I have 9 eq modes, of which I worked my butt off to get myself… nightmaring mobs… while you swam in your decanter at lyme recall whining.
I’ve earned 1450 drachma so far… to increase my mana regen. If you think my road has been easy to get to where I am…. MAKE A DRUID and find out for yourself… I bet your too weak to make it.
Toxis and Stryx used to compare each other, and he used to goad me saying how weak warriors were. But when we compared our skills, it’s obvious warriors make good tanks and druids regen fast. They each have their special skills that make them powerful in their own way.
Weasel is designed to stab, blast, and tank… and can do longer, better xp runs, while still hitting some pretty big mobs.
A quad caster druid prime is a mana bag that regens fast, no special heals and no special blasts, but can shapeshift and have lots of hp, but no parry, almost same damage in comparrison, and if stone/iron falls, or lite, you have to flee, shapeshift return, cast spells, shapeshift.. all which costs tons of mana.
So a druid quad caster is designed to kill one or two big mobs at a time. While a warrior with thief and mage in classo is designed to hit many small to medium xp/gold mobs, yet can kill a big mob if need be. The low mana regen sucks, but warriors can get almost 90 mana regen with enough work and a vault.
In the end, they’re both decent and do what they’re designed for: warriors dumb tanks, druids fast regenning tree huggers.
-Tox
Might I also point out my mana is actually only 670. I’ve made a max mana mode to get my 900. It’s called working hard… being a dumb warrior your regen is probably a pearl of the rising tide.
I have 9 eq modes, of which I worked my butt off to get myself… nightmaring mobs… while you swam in your decanter at lyme recall whining.
I’ve earned 1450 drachma so far… to increase my mana regen. If you think my road has been easy to get to where I am…. MAKE A DRUID and find out for yourself… I bet your too weak to make it.[/quote:lyptui3z]
LOL what a winner. Oh, and if this is some ‘who’s got the biggest dick’ competition, I’ve made well over a couple of thousand drachma on Weasel alone. So fcuking what? I had a number of different eq modes too, but had to trim them down as I could not carry or rent with that much eq. You have 9 different eq modes you say? No idea why you need 9 different modes, but changing 1 item does not make an eq mode. LOL. Working your butt off to get eq? Newsflash - everyone has to if they want top eq, you think that somehow makes you special?
For some reason you seem to have taken my post about those stats as some kind of personal attack. It was not, you paranoid little bunny. Yes, my classo sucks relatively speaking, I admit it, heck 2x40 chars of certain classes can do better than my avatar! And yes necros too, whatever, my point was clearly lost on you - it was about warrior primes old school, not you.
Arg.. why do I ever post here?
[quote:2jduw60g]Oh, and if this is some ‘who’s got the biggest dick’ competition,[/quote:2jduw60g]
My ‘Dick’ has 1015 mana… although its not the biggest i’ve seen.
[quote:2jduw60g]warriors dumb tanks, druids fast regenning tree huggers.
[/quote:2jduw60g]
But, Druids hug tree’s harder than warriors do :twisted:
[quote:o35t4kqv]’ve earned 1450 drachma so far… to increase my mana regen. If you think my road has been easy to get to where I am…. MAKE A DRUID and find out for yourself[/quote:o35t4kqv]
They is still a druid bug that allows you to clone items even personal. I won’t go into details but drachma schmackma, not impressed.
When I see this :
shifted 2300hp, -12ac, 7 attacks @ +26dam
I seriously think it’s time to consider retiring my character - the warrior prime class (particularly old school classo) might as well not exist anymore.
Feel free to flame.[/quote:g5rlqn04]
this, my dear weezie, is one of the reasons why i -did- retire my mortals. yes, i do have other classes, but of course, firebrand is my favorite and now she is no longer any fun to play. i am sick to death of almost any other class being able to outtank a 5x40 wa prime. i thought warriors were supposed to be the biggest, thickest, buffest badasses ingame. clearly, no one else (including our coders) seems to think that warriors are tanks anymore, so i will log in once in a while to taunt you all and to say hello to friends but my mortal days playing here are over.
have fun following a cleric tank, guys, because apparently warriors are being phased out by giving all the other classes our skills and buffs and everyone tries to get warrior ac (and gets it). there are many, MANY other reasons i have left but that is the main one. it’s gods damned bullshit when a 5x40 wa prime cannot walk in to something buffed and lit and still die in seconds when trying to help someone else. i am sick and tired of being told as a wa pime that due to not having -12 ac, wraithform, spec shield, dmg redux and a few other things that the leader would prefer firebrand playing BLASTO. are you KIDDING? with the abysmally low mana regen of being wa prime i am being asked to BLAST? what point to even having wa class anymore? patches, fixes, updates, upgrades, new skills/spells do not fix the problem. all it does is shut the bitching up for 5 minutes by being given something spiffy and new - and then everyone gets it or everyone bottlenecks on the mob(s) trying to get new item or spellbook and then we are right back where we were. warriors are useless except to get heavy armor proficiency.
stop allowing eq and skills and pets replace and phase an entire class out. quit throwing things out there that let a fukcing necro with pets go solo group mobs. that’s just a kick in the teeth to the mob builder who designed it for SEVERAL people to kill, not just one person. the idea is not to see how well you can min/max your character and then go brag about how much drachma and hi-end eq you have. the trick is to actually work together with others (multiplaying does NOT count!!!) to achieve a goal.
once long ago i was led to believe that this was a GROUP-oriented mud with things focusing on encouraging grouping and in some places flat out REQUIRING a group just to get through it. nowadays, it’s only a matter of time before someone figures out how to solo it. one of these days i am going to log in and find someone soloing atlas and luci and other epics. come to think of it, i bet brad already does with his army of chars (taunt brad). just kidding on that one but you get the idea.
okay. time to sit back and watch while this post gets flamed, picked apart and some smartass asshat shows me precisely where i am wrong.
“there’s wrong, and there’s wrong, and there’s this.” –john hartigan –sin city
how many of you leveled a druid character higher than 1x20 ?
you don’t know anything about playing druid so post some tits or gtfo, your president commands you so!
[img:23dzhjqz]http://yasik.kiev.ua/4chan/Obama_Tits_or_GTFO.jpg[/img:23dzhjqz]
What are peoples thoughts so far on using the tumbling skill as tank? Has anyone tried to figure out how much damage it reduces?[/quote:2agu14qj]
no idea I can’t seem to get tumble defense
come on reb, warriors are fun, just gotta know how to play em :)
but i do agree with u,with the new classo’s, u can practically solo anything:).
well apart from epics n the once in a while quests, grouping isnt needed almost at all.
Guess i’ll start with juggles question, tumbling sucks for tanks thieves anything that can use it. it’s a great idea but i tested it quite a lot and it gave about 12dmg redux on one attack. that’s if it fires which even using a thief prime is very rare. generally it will work once every other round and will get a full miss (avoid full dmg of attack) maybe once every 20 rounds. it’s a cute skill but utterly pointless, sorry.
yes old school tanks are missing a lot of the pretty bells and whistels of these fancy new tanks. we are no longer the top dog for large group tanks. but we can still do some pretty nifty things we’re just more handy in smaller type groups now. we can’t take hits as well, but we can dish out way more dmg than most any of the new tanks. now i know a tank’s whole purpose in life is to take dmg. but even in old school groups only one tank took the dmg, the rest had to do dmg. quit focusing on what you can’t do and embrace what you can!!
all based on being 5x40:
Old school tanks get 5 attacks!!
Even w/ moderate to crappy eq you can run -10 and 20+dmg
Throw in weapon dmg, buy 15 and a couple items, +22 suddenly!
Use valor and throw in that +42 dmg and suddenly we hit damn hard.
So wear that -12 gear in groups, if a fancy new tank comes along, switch a half dozen pieces of eq and be one helluva heavy hitter without even using any mana!!
There are still quite a few fun things you can do with the old tanks and even now i wish i hadn’t given up on strider so quickly. the thought of him at +44 w/ an aodl and a bard singing gods. ohh the carnage!!!
totally agree,but i can do pure viscous with minstrel singin gods:P with berserk of course :) n yes 5attack tanks do hit harder than a freagin piasa!
no can do. there is more to it than just not being top tank class anymore. i hate feeling useless in a group and firebrand in others’ opinions is just that - useless - useless until you need her to go run get your dead ass out of somewhere then the song and dance changes. that is when i will get a tell or a gossip or an im “help me! save deadass!”. so i stop my run with next to no mana, go relocating across the map to go find you, only to find that someone ELSE has gone to get you and raise you and then i have to sit and regen for 20 fuk king minutes, relocate back, etc etc wasting mana before i can go all the way back to where i was running. and then i either die coming to help you or i die on my runs and no one can be bothered to come get me until i corpse then it’s “so sorry”. yeah, you’re sorry. what about the xps or level i just lost? nah. not worth the frustration anymore. sorry.
i am sick of fighting for hours to get xp token only to lose all that i have earned and then some in a couple seconds. and on top of that, if i corpse, then there is the potential of getting looted, so have to yell for help, wait till someone finishes their run to come help me then take 15 minutes or more just hunting down all my looted eq, which is total BULL SHIT. we fight hard enough for our eq with cycling, drachma and forges only to have to go and recapture it off a damn thief mob - or several of them if in a room or area where there are a lot of looting mobs. it’s kinda stupid to double-cycle for the same item, isn’t it?
i am not playing her as a thief, as a cleric or a mage. she is (or was until she became a funny-looking relic) a goddamned TANK. that is the way i have built her and worked on her for the past 9 years or so. she was pretty buff for a while - she was one of the top few tanks in game. and then new classes came along and there came wraithform and spectral shield and damage reduction. all of a sudden i saw a 2x40 monk with new spells/skills/buffs and debuffs able to outtank a 5x40 warrior. i got told that it was smarter to have a tank that didn’t need heals. what a total insult that was.
and then to watch a fuk king NECRO with jujus go solo demogorgon while i had to have a full group with healo, blasto, and stabba MINIMUM. i don’t appreciate all the hours of time and effort invested in her making her a tank get thrown in my face when i am asked to be simple meat in the group. and don’t tell me to make another character. i have. several, in fact. but none of them is firebrand. i know that EVERY SINGLE ONE OF YOU has a character that you like to play more than your alts. and thanks to nerfs, buffs, and new classes, i don’t like to play her anymore. why should i stay and play something that is no longer any fun? like i said in this post and the previous one, there are other factors that are also contributing to my decision to hang up my mortal hat and just focus on building for you guys.
yeah, i want the ac and the damage and shit but i have to give up too much and i -still- can do nothing more than run coins solo with her unless i want to hit abysmally underlevel mobs. i don’t like killing only one or two mobs and regenning for 10 damn minutes while i wait for mana regen, wait for spells to fall, recast spells, regen AGAIN so that i have some running mana and then use it all up on two more mobs. fukk a whole bunch of that shit. tell me to find a partner or a group? no, thank you. most of the time, the partner is a newbie that waits for my reporter or whiner to fire before they bother to heal me, or they stay out of the fight to blindness the mob while i stand there fighting, dying, and getting no heals because they won’t get in the fight, assist me by providing more damage, throwing heals on me and then using in-combat shit.
do you know how many times i have been in a LYME group - a place where you should know how to group - and heard newbie shit? “who is the tank?” “who do i prot?” etc. if you don’t know how to use the group command and SEE the point flag or the person under leader and KNOW they are tank, if you don’t know that the person below you is the one you protect (once the leader says “fix prots”), if you don’t automatically know what the hell to do by then with only basic instructions then gtfo lyme. i have no use for you. i am not dying because you either bought the character or you were powerlevved up and still have more than half of your spells and skills unlearned because you haven’t had time to get the books and still you don’t know your ass from a hole in the ground.
bah. why do i even bother. long story even longer, i retired my mortals - at least for a while. sloth will always hold a place in my heart, i will always be on the fringes, but it’s time to turn my efforts to other things. i hope that some of the stuff ember (me) has in store for you, you will come to enjoy.
“my daddy always said, “when you want to hammer a nail, don’t do anything fancy. just get a hammer and pound the son of a bitch.” -church –>soldier
Ive said it many times…all it takes is to implement a new spell to allow a prime necro to cast wraithform on another player then all your old school or hybrid tanks are now capable of tanking everything just about equally.
Wraith charms dont last long enough but fluid charms work well.
And who was this necro who solod demo? I have a pretty decent necro running -11 and still cant take stuff that my Tard warrior can w/o wraithform.
Was this before Demonweb got buffed or after?
Im sure I need necro lessons but there really arent a lot of higher necros up there anymore because they have been NERFED ALREADY.
just gotta love a good firebrand rant. being a tank has nothing to do w/ your first set of problems as far as helping other chars. it happens to all people regardless of class. though it is a bit more time for you to regen but probly not a whole lot since even though your regen is low so is your max mana most likely.
there are areas out there for tanks. one lyme one comes to mind that if you bother wearing -12 gear and walk around hacking mobs you can easily make 100+mil an hour solo and never have to regen. but that would require learning something new.
while i would love having wraithform castable on others. the imms probly take too much pleasure in seeing tanks waste an entire class for two spells that are helpful. wraithform and spectral. just think if tanks didn’t have to waste a class for those two spells!!
It’s a simple fix..just add new warrior skill Enhanced Maneuver
Enhanced maneuver will allow a warrior to not only successfully dodge 2-3 attacks per round but also randomly add an additonal counter-attack.
Problem solved
8)
The grass is always greener on the other side isnt it. :idea:
All those people rambling about others being able to solo this and that - have you ever consider that may be they have spent more time getting superior eq or maybe they have better stats or maybe they know something you dont about killing things more efficiently.
Plus as many people have mentioned some classes are better at doing certain things. You wouldnt send a thief/war/cl/mo to solo a fire machine for example and you wouldnt expect a dr/cl/ma/ba to be able to solo 150m per hour. Or you might just have a completely stupid class that is not good at anything, so who is to blame for that.
And I dont see any reason why some people should not be able to solo something huge if they have the right classo for it and if they have spent alot of time getting the right gear. As apprentice says, you try getting 900 mana and that extra ac point and damage for shift mode. It all adds up to alot of playtime and alot of effort and i dont see why he shouldnt be able to solo something that a medium geared warrior cant.
And if you think old style warrior classo’s suck, just look at Shimbo. He is a perfect example of what you can achieve if you just try harder.
There is no such classo where you can start start a char, sail through without rolling good stats, without getting the best eq and actually soloing something that others cant. It is all down to what effort you put into something.
Im sorry but if you cant be arsed to put that effort into something, dont go crying that others are better than you.
There really is nothing more that we can do to stop comparisons between the old school classes and new school except do a pwipe. Which we obviously have not wanted to go that route. Most players who feel or had felt the way Firebrand does have gone on to make a new character and put their time and effort into something different which ultimately they have enjoyed more. It makes far more sense to play a character that you have hopes for and have fun with than laboring with one that you do not enjoy playing anymore for various reasons…
It has taken us this long to balance the classes and get them near the point where the administration is content. There is no arguing the point that the new classes brought an ungodly amount of power and threw our mud entirely out of whack for awhile. Back then, the majority of old players were pissed off that new classos involving a couple of the new classes would overtake them as the best this or the best that. Some of these players joined the rat race to have a chance at maintaining the label of being the "best", others continued to play their original characters. Those players are now even further behind throughout no other choice other than their own.
After playing just about every classo we have to offer and even wiping several of my most favorite and overpowered characters, I can only give the advice to pick classes that you like and play a style that you enjoy. It makes no sense laboring with a character simply because you have so much time invested in it when there is a relatively good chance you can create a new one and find out you are actually having fun once again.
Splork
I agree with Splork and the only thing I can add is the problem I met when I started my new classo char. When it was pretty new time came to fix necro pets, then necro debuffs, then non-warrior AC. From the first sight I though immortals play new classo chars and then start to ’nerf’ them when other players start to play. I even posted some crap on crier about it (my apologies to immortals). But now I believe they just tried to bring balance to Sloth and it’s simply impossible to make change if you don’t know strong and weak sides of the classes. I know that even bigger games development companies make changes in their commercial games to bring more balance (and as for me Sloth was and still is much better than those commercial muds).
So I don’t whine any more and try to learn how to play my new balanced bard (by the way thanks much to Minstrel for tons of info about it).
If you want to start new char be ready to some ’nerfs’ especially if you start non-balanced classo (i.e. druids). But warriors seems to be very balanced now and I believe there will be no ’nerfs’ for them.
Vixn
and again
why everyone complain about Druids being overpowered?
it’s just plain wrong
+130 mr at ~20Av makes you think so?
don’t forget that Druids fight in forms, which takes mana to maintain
also, you can’t use ANY skills or spells while in form, like Backstab, Damnation etc, anything
oh yeah, you can use breathe weapons, which ALSO consumes mana
so you just spell up, shapshift and jump at mob, hoping none of your spells fall down while in combat, or you’re so dead or at least screwed up
so, you end up injured and your mana burned
also, remember the fact that Druids can’t just Aegis self and go wreak havoc, them need to be shifted to fight or them are in trouble, so if you’re caugh by aggro mob you have only one option : retreat from fight, which also adds a bit of spice to playstyle
i dont see how increased mana regen can compensate all those inconveniences, that’s why i say : Druids are underpowered and need mr increase even moar because mana is our life and everything
if anyone think otherwise there’s a way to resolve this disagreement : make a Druid character and play to 3x40 AT LEAST
then i’d like to hear an opinion again
PS. Druid mr bonus applies only in “outdoors” rooms, indoors you get regular 2xCa mr
Probably falls under druids being able to solo MOB’s warriors cant and more than 1 at a time….warriors should put down the sword and maybe take up fishing.
Probably falls under druids being able to solo MOB’s warriors cant and more than 1 at a time….warriors should put down the sword and maybe take up fishing.[/quote:rg0d8orl]
Hence the [b:rg0d8orl]=[/color:rg0d8orl]sMAc=[/color:rg0d8orl][/b:rg0d8orl] clan - the SlothMud Anglers Club. :D
I’ve said it before, but I agree with Angel. It’s a quick fix to tank characters to allow wraithform to be cast on others. It seems clear that this would improve the chances of players cooperating with each other. Groups would actually welcome a necro, while for now their most powerful abilities (pets) usually effectively annoy any xp groups.
To think of it another way, the cleric sanc spell is castable on others. Small clerics used to be the d-sanc. (Before long-lasting Aegis came along.) This improved grouping, as you usually wanted some small clerics or prime clerics in the group.
As for the rest of the arguments, it’s clear that new class characters are very effective at taking down the large mobs solo. That’s a 5 mil exp cap, normally, so if you’re interested in xp runs you might not like a druid. I prefer my old-class Wa/Th, all things considered.
i’ve never failed to be ammused by the debate over old-school classos vs new classes.
as splork mentioned, there wouldn’t have been this debate had they just done a pwipe when new classes went in. You were allowed to keep your old-school chars so you should be thankful for that for a start.
2ndly, ppl who are too stubborn to go with hte flow and move with times, and instead inssit that they “refuse to do this, refuse to do that”, but in the end bitch about falling behind in the game, I’d say get a grip. anyone who was a good player with hte old school classes, either make new classes and get good with their new chars, or figure out new ways to make their old classos work. Those who bitch about not being able to play as well now, probably weren’t all that good to begin with.
3rdly, I don’t think the game has really changed that much to the extent that your old classos couldn’t do things that they used to do. You didn’t use to be able to solo demo, so why are you bitching that you can’t now? Any new additions to ANY class, is obviosuly going to affect ALL classos. Any additions to warrior class would affect warriors of all classos.
I think it’s a gross generalisation that people would let ANY warrior with wraithform and damage reduction tank. I’ve been in groups where the tank had these requisites, but were completely clueless. I’ve led groups where both firebrand and rub (old school tanks) had tanked, and I would rather have moved the group to an appropriate area, than to let someone else in the group tank. It’s all about finding an area that your char can handle, not to make your char handle all areas. You don’t see autolycos stabbing in trogs.
you guys clamoured for changes to the game back then coz the game was getting stagnant. The admin implemented new classes, and now you’re saying you don’t want the changes anymore coz you’re too lazy to play the game the way it’ss et up now. that’s just retarded
You don’t see autolycos stabbing in trogs.[/quote:fu8wr4k0]
lmao!
yeah… I agree.. its all in what you actually want to do. I have 2 decent new classo chars, but I still love runnin archaic Auto. I use a lot of charms and coconuts to compensate for new spells and the occasional purlioned spectral :twisted:
any char classo can be great if you spend the time.
So the argument is not that old classo warrior primes aren’t up to par, but that the players who have them are too lazy to be bothered scrapping their characters and starting again from scratch. Got it.
I think the point was: if you are not having fun with the character you are playing, start a new one :P
I think the point was: if you are not having fun with the character you are playing, start a new one :P[/quote:3qtt0qy8]
nods.. amounts to the same thing. It’s a matter of perception. Even if the old character itself has remained static (meaning it’s still capable of what it always was), it’s the frustration of knowing that some other classos are doing far more and doing it at lower levels while you are sitting there spending the bulk of the time regenning or hitting lower value mobs because you can’t hit those big ones back to back. The perception is you’re not playing on an even field, even though you’re able to do what you always were able to do and were happy with previously. Does that make more sense? How about an analogy: “hey I worked really hard for years getting this ‘71 Ford Mustang convertible all pimped out and running at it’s peak and I love it, but that boy-racer with the new standard factory model is running rings around me - this sucks!”
:?
I think the point was: if you are not having fun with the character you are playing, start a new one :P[/quote:2wrff7de]
tap, when did you hack splork’s account? i hear there are serious repercussions for that.
so basically it’s “we don’t care how hard you worked on that character. conform and suck it up like everyone else.” got it. make a new char indeed. thanks, but no thanks. btdt, tyvm, but none of them are firebrand. that would be like someone going to school for 16 years to become a phD and then being told “all of your hard work is useless. we use robots programmed by 5th graders to do that now. go back to school and learn something else.”
at what point will you stop killing off the desire for anyone to stay and keep playing? when there is no one left to play but the curious few who wander in once in a while - either to find out what we are or are returning players who wonder who is still here? yes, there are a handful still here…most of them are those who have formed long-standing friendships here. it’s sad. i hate to see the end of an era but here it comes.
“put… the bunny… back… in the box.” -cameron poe –> con air
its all irrelevant - time vs result
you either complain about not being able, or not doing.
you dont want to try, you dont want not to.
simply put. the complaints will always come from those who act by not acting.
… it’s the frustration of knowing that some other classos are doing far more and doing it at lower levels while you are sitting there spending the bulk of the time regenning or hitting lower value mobs…[/quote:3sexyoqb]
It’s all came from your individualistic philosophy. If you’d be the Buddhist you’d be fine with just sitting on the bottom and regening with no F@k1#& exp, EQ or leveling. Choose your confession wisely! :)
p.s. BTW I believe ‘make-new-char’ philosophy came from Buddhism too. As for me it’s some sort of reincarnation :twisted:
that would be like someone going to school for 16 years to become a phD and then being told “all of your hard work is useless.[/quote:1skar00n]
Huh, probably we have very different education systems but what you said is very close to real life I think.
look, nobody’s saying you HAVE to make a new character.
fact is, you can still take your old school tank and run through the old areas and earn probably as much xp as you did in the past. Last I checked, the exp needed for levelling remains pretty much the same.
I don’t see how the new classes can “kill your desire” to stay. What there is for old classos to do, is the same as what there is for the new classos to do. Most of the characters I’ve made (except for one which consists entirely of new classes) only consist of ONE new class. I’ll never be a good/great player in the mould of say Strider or Truth or Ezekiel or Minstrel to name but a few. That’s due to a lack of effort on my part to learn the game and spend enough time. I don’t bitch about how much better their characters are. Only piece of drachma eq I have on poit is the crystalline robe, and the past few weeks I’ve lost much eq due to my own stupidity. But hell, I just have fun all the same.
this reminds me of a self-labelled “only tank on sloth” who goes by the mudname of corwin…one day he logged on and started ripping on the admin for implementing new warrior skills because it meant he had to spend the time to learn how to use them.
you don’t NEED the new skils or new classes to be able to mud….heck teron played for a long time in a classo that’s probably worse than any old school classo. and please don’t use the analogy of doing a phD for 16 years and being told it’s no longer relavant, because it happens everyday if you haven’t noticed. perhaps you’d rather go back to the stoneage because those guys sure as hell worked hard to decorate their caves.
anyone who wants to leave will find somehting to justify their excuse…heck just the other day we had someone cryin about leaving only to return 2 hours later.
its all irrelevant - time vs result
you either complain about not being able, or not doing.
you dont want to try, you dont want not to.
simply put. the complaints will always come from those who act by not acting.[/quote:lp4wssfh]
Wrong dude. I’ve started a number of new classo chars and new classo mixes, as well as thief primes more recently, but just got too frustrated thinking of all those years of working up Weasel and now having to start again because of imbalance, whether perceived or not. Also there’s rerolling stats. I can’t stand rerolling.. grrr.
notice it’s always the warriors and clerics whining…
u never see old school thieves whinning about thieves with monk and bard (before the berzerk changes went in etc.)
notice it’s always the warriors and clerics whining…
u never see old school thieves whinning about thieves with monk and bard (before the berzerk changes went in etc.)[/quote:23o1pt49]
That’s because Thief primes are not Warrior primes. I’ve started a couple of thief primes recently; one old-school classo, one mixed, because Thief primes don’t appear to have so much of an issue.. all you’re doing by your ‘argument’ is clarifying the problem is with [b:23o1pt49]old-school Warrior primes[/b:23o1pt49] in particular (and maybe old-school Cleric primes too - dunno, I don’t have a cleric prime that is old-school only), so thank you for backing us up.
:)
[quote:2qmva0nr]heck just the other day we had someone cryin about leaving only to return 2 hours later[/quote:2qmva0nr]
13 doesn’t count.
8)
Exactly! Everything in this thread supports my own opinion!
[img:30z48ewh]http://theblacksentinel.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/blind.jpg[/img:30z48ewh]