What do you think should be the maximum reasonable pop rate to pop an item?
Surely there is a fine line between, making things a challenge, and ruining game play from senseless cycling.
The truth remains, if a player can kill a mob, and pop it’s item, he will… no matter what the pop rate… so what is the point of having them excessively long?
I personally think that anything over 1/50 (24hrs of continuous cycling) is too long… what do you think?
pop rates aren’t really that low. hypothetically you could flip a coins 50 times and it land same side up. sometimes you unlucky.
if i’d be admin i’d make pop-rates very low
players leave when they reach all their goals and nothing to strive for
so must keep them from reaching it = keep them ingame
PS. i cycled wa-prime autoquest item (sword of valor) for 1.5 months with a few breaks for food/sleep + minimal work, so any poprate is high enough to me after that
Not that it really matters, but there is no way you are going to toss a fair coin 50 times in a row and get all heads or all tails. Odds are 1/2 for one flip, 1/2 to the 50th power for 50 flips in a row gives number of order 10^-16. If you do one flip a second, that work out to over 35mil years of flipping on average to get 50 in a row. Better start cycling now. :)
35mil years is about how long it takes to get that damn librarian in Castle Black to load that parchment!!
longer pops = fewer of that item = increased value of that item
not everyone in the game should have every item of topnotch eq for their class. how would that be fun?
PS. i cycled wa-prime autoquest item (sword of valor) for 1.5 months with a few breaks for food/sleep + minimal work, so any poprate is high enough to me after that[/quote:1jvp551a]
Really? I popped it first time for my wa … guess I was lucky.
On the coin toss thing but there is no way you are going to toss a fair coin 50 times in a row and get all heads or all tails[/quote:1jvp551a] its not that theres no way its just that its improbable. Google for Derren Browns ‘[i:1jvp551a]The System[/i:1jvp551a]’
Don’t touch pop rates. Just make ‘dance of the 7 luck gods’ work better for hard-pop items. As I know dance makes pop-rate twice better when 5x40 bard sing this song. It could be trice better for items with pop-rate worse then say 1d50. Or something like that.
Tonight will be the 7th day in a row of running the castle black librarian… I don’t care if it takes another 20 days… I will keep going till it pops…
Which begs the question… this stingy pop rate is just making me annoyed and wasting my time… I’m gonna get it anyway… so how many more days must I waste? It’s just getting to the point of being senseless. I’ve killed the mob well over 100 times… The pop rate must be 1/50+…
Why can’t we just move on? To kill him for another 5 days proves what? Does this make people want to play sloth? Have I not paid my penance killing him 100 times? I accept the idea of hard work, and how it can increase item value, rar rar rar, but this is bordering the ridiculous.
:evil:
I told you to prepare to run longer :) , we all pay our dues to run the eq / cps we want to forge em now hush up and pay yours! :evil:
Ps You think thats bad? Try forging scarab of destruction or ars, or ring of the flaming serpents, or any other serious, real hard forge :)
Nods, frustrating as hell running a mob and it never seems to load (I recall one cp not so long ago where I killed the loading mob a couple of hundred times before it loaded, and spent several weeks doing it, at times for 12-15 hours at a stretch), even worse is when someone else hits it and it loads on the second or third kill.
As I understand it, 1D50 is about the highest (worst) poprate used? Maybe there should be some sort of ‘fail-safe’ built in where after say 75 consecutive kills, the mob will load (of course if the mud crashes it would reset back to 0 again).. just so it doesn’t get utterly ridiculous.
I’m liking weasels suggestion, where you could have “max kills” on a mob before it pops. I’m not so sure about making those kills belong to one player, but just force it to pop for who ever kills it when max kills is reached. Obviously reset back to zero when it does pop.
Using random numbers to determine whether an item pops gets mathematically flawed the higher the numbers get. Although mathematically speaking the item given a pop rate of 1/50 should pop 1/50 THAT IS ONLY ON AVERAGE… and the max time it takes to pop could actually end up being in the 100’s of cycles.
I made this quick Sub in Visual Basic…
Private Sub TruePopRate()
Dim intCount as Integer
Dim intValue As Integer
Dim blnFound As Boolean
Do While blnFound = False
intValue = Int((50 * Rnd) + 1)
If intValue = 50 Then
blnFound = True
Else
intCount = intCount + 1
End If
Loop
MsgBox “You killed the mob " & intCount & " times for pop.”
End Sub
This Sub set the poprate as 1/50, but you can see for yourself, sometimes it can mean you have to kill into the 100’s (178) was my highest, in order to get pop.
Max kills could be 1.5 or 2 times the poprate.
It’s an absolute no brainer that most 5x40’s that have squandered there lives playing this game for an excessive period of time, won’t like this idea under the typical… “My Life is Hard, I’m gonna make yours to!” rule… I already know your opinion… With less players on… and an ever increasingly sized world, there are less items around to be traded as spare, like maybe there was in the past. (Or maybe Brad’s alts have them all ;))
Just a question to this. What happens if said item is going to load for sure after say 75 kills. You keep killing mob for 60 kills then have to leave. You come back at 70 kills with someone else already cycling it now. They get the pop. I can see this would cause problems with some people.
I would say leave pop rates as they are, yes because we all had to do it this way… also its just the luck of the die so to speak. I got Lrogg to load after killing about 6-8 times in 1 run of cycling. Ask others how long this took. Also CB librarian/Morrigan loaded after 1 night of cycling for me. On the same note, it took me about 1 week to load Morrigan a different time and I cycled erchyle for 1.5 weeks and went away with nothing.
You keep killing mob for 60 kills then have to leave.[/quote:gi7kgo1h]
I think the only place this imaginary person would have to leave is hospital or morgue. 60 kills * 40 min average repop time = 40 hrs non-stop cycling. :D
Anyway, cease the spam (c) Jake. Nothing you say/complain in this thread is goin to change anything. Put your spirit watcher on duty, then surf/troll/fap/movie/cartoons/etc/etc while repop. Item will load eventually.
[quote:3equr0ne]I think the only place this imaginary person would have to leave is hospital or morgue. 60 kills * 40 min average repop time = 40 hrs non-stop cycling.[/quote:3equr0ne]
Who said anything about 60kills non-stop, clever dick!
40hrs cycling is easy to achieve in 3 days for some people.
Just a question to this. What happens if said item is going to load for sure after say 75 kills. You keep killing mob for 60 kills then have to leave. You come back at 70 kills with someone else already cycling it now. They get the pop. I can see this would cause problems with some people.
[/quote:1gqrv1lj]
No different from how things are now - if you leave it, then it’s open for someone else to hit. Alternatively, get a friend to run it for you while you’re away.
If anything make it 1/50 on first kill, if it does load then 1/49, 1/48, 1/47.
Until the damn thing pops. Not too hard I would believe, and after the 49th
kill it will load. Of course on the next repop it still has a 1/50 pop rate etc…
What sucks to are spellbooks trying to pop!
The idea is more about stopping the ridiculous.
It’s not about improving the pop rates, [b:3s6rvn9j]it’s about minimizing the max deviation from the average[/b:3s6rvn9j]. The idea does not change the pop rate! The pop rate remains the same!
Truth is, if it were implemented, except for those times when you cycle a mob for a whole week… there would probably be no perceived difference.
It would be annoying if someone got the max pop before me, but at least at that point I would have the mob to myself again, and there is more to go around. Some forges are fairly essential.
What sucks to are spellbooks trying to pop![/quote:321alboa]
oh lord….will made a good point! and worse, i agree!!!!!!! what is the point to making sbs either too bloody expensive at drachma shop or have such a low poprate that some sbs will take sometimes months or even years (some of us cannot mud 24/7) before a char can finish reading? i think poprates should be considered with the amount of time someone can realistically spend cycling a mob…..and if that person happens to be on limited time allotment - such as in internet cafes, campus computer lab closing and foul parents who will only allow son/daughter/hatchling to get online for a couple hours at a time, etc - then they are most likely not going to have much of a chance to sit on a mob and cycle it. and while i am at it, why put some sbs on mobs that are either group sized or are on continents that char cannot get to to pop it?
“patience, iago, patience” –jafar –> disney’s aladdin
Teaching went a long way to helping this situation, but still some sb’s pop on insanely bad mobs. Which teaching didn’t address… because you still don’t have the spellbook!
Dark Cloak
Chronos
Crit Strike
Mass Fly
Pains in the butt! :D
I ironically seem to be having trouble popping the “slow” spellbook… it’s my only unlearned under level 22… the hours I’ve spent cycling every flippin turtle on island, BH and AH is laughable. I figured that monster turtle in siren’s rock would have a high pop rate given it’s like a 3mill mob - For a lvl 17 spell… its just weird… really weird… :twisted:
Always wondered why all warrior skills/spells can only be learned up to 85%, whereas casters etc go to 95% ..and then you can increase some further with teaching.
Stop it, all spellbooks got pretty nice poprates, except high spells in classo. And with eq not so bad, as i know max poprates in game like 1d45. Add some more for autoquest items. Think, you just not so lucky. You can cycle mob all day, 20-30 kills and after going to rest, some1 come and take pop.
I know people who spend long time for get stuff, and know who almost always takes it after 2-5 repops. Yes, it happens.
More people, after take all what they want, gonna rest for long time or stop playing forever. It online game, not usual PC game, when you can do all fast… imho
P.S. Kill itself about a wall.
P.P.S. I’am not so bad and evil, but so much whine about Sloth life. It are game and i LOVE it! :twisted:
Bazilus the Crazy Python.
Spellbook pop rates eh……so nice of you to think of Shyla, Since she will pop almost any spellbook for you if you treat her nice and ask. Most spells aren’t bad pop rates anyways.
chronos - dark wiz in cano about 1/4
dark cloak- kachina will bring u.
crit strike and mass fly seem to be around if you ask for them after a few days.
Hell even blizzard popped twice in 5 kills the last time we cycled it.
and teaching did address the problem mostly, since you only need 1 sb instead of 2.
I guess they don’t call it the Crier for nothin’ huh?
I guess they don’t call it the Crier for nothin’ huh?[/quote:2lgopfjg]
lmfao
Ever notice that the few sbs that are hard to pop are spells you can easily get by without? And the stingy eq is normally one of the best options for any given slot?
You could still enjoy Sloth and have a decent char without ever spending weeks cycling, but it seems obvious that the people willing/able to put in more time and work are going to come out with better stuff.
There’s no real way to allow those of us with less time to mud to get better things in the time they’re on without either still having the players who are on a lot getting even more, or creating some kind of ridiculous “everybody wins” system.
We live and die by the roll of dice, the mob that gets a lucky round of hits and kills you easily translates into a pop that just won’t load. It’s random number generator, not a perfect average generator.
Also, would you give up getting lucky and popping something stingy on the second kill in exchange for not getting unlucky on something else and having to cycle more?
I’m killing Lord Morrigan at the moment for the diamond studded clasp. I’ve heard he is stingy, but I haven’t killed him enough to know yet.
Funny thing is… I’d rather kill him than the librarian… Morrigan is a challenge, he’s thick, he has that annoying reflection up, and he casts a few spells. It takes me 2.5 runs to kill him.
I can tell you the librarian is aegis/wf/haste shift dragon 10x Breathe Fire… and a 40minute wait… that’s boring as… when you’ve done it 100 times.
I guess I’m saying, Morrigan has my respect, I need to employ strategy, and therefore every kill is a bit of a small victory.
It’s not always about stingy pop-rates, sometimes the mob is just boringly annoying AND has a stingy pop rate, those ones really suck…
If your camping out 40 mins for a repop u need something else to do in the mean time. I addressed this 2 ways, 1 pick up more mobs to kill on that cont for gold, books, eq, whatever or 2 read a book or surf the web while u wait.
There is no reason to be bored for 40 mins.
Your right, I hit stalkers for a little xp from time to time, but I’m useless at multitasking :( I died and lost all my stalker xp exploring, so I thought, this is a dumb idea. I some times swivel around my chair and play my drums while I wait. But after 7days… I don’t care what you do inbetween, it’s tiresome.
Good thing about Morrigan it almost takes the pop time to 2.5 run him and prepare for next onslaught.
You want a REAL challenge near the Stalkers???
Go kill Drakken Forest, and try not to die in there :)
Do all you spells, and shift. Go in and make sure u kill 1 soldier vine at a
time, if there is more then one push QUICK. Lead with breath blast and it
takes about 2-3 to kill a soldier. Lead with 1 breath for the workers as
they are not aggro if I remember. There is something else too i forget …
The area is about a good 6mil run and can be done within a min or two.
Then regen and get full. Run to Onyx Tower, which is alreays fun. Be very
sneaky as there are aggro mobs around the run. Once in tower flee east to
get past the blocking mob. Kill Broomsticks, and Feather Duster. Again
lead with breath. It use to take me about 2 runds to clear them all out.
Total exp is also around 6-7 mil.
That helps kill the time. Or Stalkers, which is all chop mobs.
I like posting as other people and getting them dates with the most mis-matched people I can find. You can also use noise command to tell u when MB has reset and play your playstation3 or whatever while you wait for the beep. It’s not botting and it helps when groups are closed and/or dead ICQ’ing for someone to come help. Also good for when doing laundry.
I wouldn’t say it’s a mis-match. I use to play “Leaf” and he was able to kill
in there as 40 38 xx xx. Made him like 3x40 within a few weeks soloing
in there. Sure i died and corpsed alot, but made alot more.
bump
I’ve been cycling 4 somewhat legendary stingy (quest) mobs for well over 24hrs of playing time without pops now… Look, I’m ok with it, and I will continue to do this until they pop… I’ve had lots of fun in between… but with that said… To kill a mob 50 times in sloth is something I’ve accepted… but going on after this… I think highlights a counter productive aspect of a game, that’s supposed to be made for fun and enjoyment.
A 1/50 chance of a pop rate is an average… And typically the deviation can be twice the ratio meaning… sometimes it will only take 1 or sometimes 100. The chance of it being over 50 kills is 50%. Like I’ve said… I will continue… I will win! But this cost is stupidity and counter productive in a game meant for fun, isn’t it?
Rynquald said it all. Everyone of us has his fast pops and long pops. Ive poped 3 lava mages in row, a lot ppl have cycled him for months. Thats life, youll get lucky with other pops. Everyone who wrote here that its ridiculous, check your memory for fast pops you had (which were supposed to be long) and that balances your popruns. You cant get every pop to be poped at least within dices (like 1d50, 1d49 idea).
I never liked gold runs (until elemental school area), my money getting way was poping rare pops or forging eq that was sellable - feathered cincture, infernite gauns. Not that those are with good poprate but I still got my coins :)
AND STOP WHINING!!
man, evergreen shud go forge more stuffs for me to buy:)
If 1 in 50 was an average, no one would have any eq.
bump
I’ve been cycling 4 somewhat legendary stingy (quest) mobs for well over 24hrs of playing time without pops now… Look, I’m ok with it, and I will continue to do this until they pop… I’ve had lots of fun in between… but with that said… To kill a mob 50 times in sloth is something I’ve accepted… but going on after this… I think highlights a counter productive aspect of a game, that’s supposed to be made for fun and enjoyment.
A 1/50 chance of a pop rate is an average… And typically the deviation can be twice the ratio meaning… sometimes it will only take 1 or sometimes 100. The chance of it being over 50 kills is 50%. Like I’ve said… I will continue… I will win! But this cost is stupidity and counter productive in a game meant for fun, isn’t it?[/quote:2it5obf1]
My bad, change the “A” to an “IF.” I really don’t claim all eq is 1/50 heh…
Was a funny night tonight, ISP fibre link was failing, causing 2-5mins lags. One of the mobs popped, it took me about 15mins to get there shift and kill it. I also finished up another quest… so on my most successful night in 4 to 5 days… I get the luck when my ISP is barely functional…
In fact I wrote this entire post waiting for my rent command to make it through to the mud.
My bad, change the “A” to an “IF.” I really don’t claim all eq is 1/50 heh…
Was a funny night tonight, ISP fibre link was failing, causing 2-5mins lags. One of the mobs popped, it took me about 15mins to get there shift and kill it. I also finished up another quest… so on my most successful night in 4 to 5 days… I get the luck when my ISP is barely functional…
In fact I wrote this entire post waiting for my rent command to make it through to the mud.[/quote:1ganv4tk]
time to upgrade from dial-up
“ok, a limosine that can fly. now i have seen everything.” -gary johnston –team america: world police