beware of doing things too well on s4, itll be nerfed! this mud isnt fixed up n proper yet,its shud be called a beta mud rather than a mud imo.
“The name “Sloth” was chosen to embody the original philosophy of the mud, which was to make everybody’s lives as easy as possible.”
funny how ironic this turned out to be:)
I’m not sure exactly what your complaint is, but maybe if you hadn’t devoted every waking moment to this game, you wouldn’t have bumped up against the upper limits. Just a thought.
eg: 2man fallon,4 run subdued,next 2days,nerfed,dragon hits all viscous thru sanc now:) go figure.
some1 said it wasnt fair that u a feef and a warrior could subdue fallon..hence yada yada yada
so ur saying we shud be discouraged to play sloth now?
Of course sloth is always changing and could be hit with a ‘beta’ tag. It’s been that way for 15 years. When the imms stop working on it, it dies.
So imms should never adjust mobs if they feel their reward is too high for their difficulty, or only the mobs nobody ever runs? Fallon gives premium eq, along with a massively high drachma reward when subdued. If anyone at our current levels can 2 man it, then duh it’s too small. Be grateful you were able to get away with 2-manning as long as you did instead of bitching you can’t anymore.
fallon has been there for ages,ppl used to solo it in s3, but no they didnt nerf it then.
in this version when we 2man that dork,it gets nerfed..
same thing happened to magi etc,i mean fix something properly b4 u let ppl play with it. Nerfing has been one of the worse things that can happen to a game.
Nerfing has been one of the worse things that can happen to a game.[/quote:1m75bkjm]
I agree with that. But nerfing also makes it run. It’s an instrument of mud evolution if you want. Relax you still can kill it with a group.
Kida.
[quote:1zqeoab8]“The name “Sloth” was chosen to embody the original philosophy of the mud, which was to make everybody’s lives as easy as possible.”
funny how ironic this turned out to be:)[/quote:1zqeoab8]
You’re right. We should just make every mob worth 1bil exp since you know, leveling might be hard. Forget gold, forget death, that might be misconstrued as too difficult and conflict with this supposed ’easy’ philosophy that has been on the front page for ages. We should also put everything into one room since writing any more is too hard, as is remembering any runs aside from logging in.
[quote:1zqeoab8]fallon has been there for ages,ppl used to solo it in s3, but no they didnt nerf it then.
in this version when we 2man that dork,it gets nerfed..
same thing happened to magi etc,i mean fix something properly b4 u let ppl play with it.[/quote:1zqeoab8]
Thank you for recognizing that this has been broken for ages. Yes, we should have fixed Fallon properly earlier, and I apologize that you had to fight the unfixed version for so long. We aren’t omniscient, so we can only really go by what people tell us/personal observations when we appear as morts. None of the changes are meant to target individuals.
Blackmore is absolutely right in his assessment of why Fallon was changed. Don’t forget he also loads a cp for the .6 sabatons and his corpse is worth another little bit of drachma.
You can credit me with the changes if you’re looking for someone to grumble at. I’ll also be responsible for a few more upcoming ’nerfs’ (how does this even make sense? Fallon was made stronger, not weaker. shrug!). Most will be to accommodate the huge increase in player power since the mob’s inception, along with several reductions where someone forgot to reset a mob after a quest. Other areas will be tweaked so that they are actually productive.
These changes have been a long time coming.
Chobbs!
Nice come back Chobbs, not that you need it but you got my support for the fixing of Sloth.
I understand why angel is angry … everyone is when their favorite toy is taken away … personally I dont mind too much, perhaps angel should have shared then I might care some.
Imms here have always in my opinion worked for what they see as the good of the mud, most of us from time to time disagree with them over something or other, but dosen’t take away from the fact that they’re doing a good and welcome job. Mostly they dont get much thanks, just grief, flames, abuse and complaints (and often from me).
Sometimes its good to step back and say thanks. Doubly so if you can pull off your last comment.
Other areas will be tweaked so that they are actually productive.[/quote:xs13ifim]
Thanks,
T
Other areas will be tweaked so that they are actually productive.[/quote:1nsv94fb]
Are you refering to area’s that no one goes to because of crap xp/coins… and you only ever go there because of a spellbook, one item or a quest? I hope so :twisted:
Are you going to report changes made to area’s and new items specifically put into the game?
I don’t see many old DoW players on anymore… and they seemed to be the “explorers” and “adventurers” on the mud… everyone used there maps and ran areas because Lis and Stryx found the eq there first and listed it for the benefit of everyone else. Given there absence, and the retirement of some old players… I wonder who is going to step up and do this job?
Area’s without maps rarely get run… there is that least favorite area of mine on AH with all the swarming looting aggros with the fishing lures… I forget the name, I think someone did eventually make a map which I never saw… and also that cave area over near the nightwalker on AH, no one ran because no maps. There was rumured to be spelldam eq or something in there, that no one but shyla could barely remember because it was that long ago, and no one goes there anymore. I remember Toxis put some new eq over on some mobs in Dweb before the change, don’t think we found it all either. Things to me look like they might just stay like that…
I guess I’m thinking I hope the players of the new sloth can find the things that you put in, because it was mostly resting on a couple of people in the old sloth… and they aren’t around anymore. Hate to see no one find your new work because, we all caught up in xp and eq that we know about, that we can’t be bothered cycling a mob a gazillion times to work out it pops something no one has found.
Maybe it’s time to look at implementing that bard song that gets a mob to report if it indeed pops an item… without knowing it’s name? Unless someone is offering to be the next Lis? I certainly don’t have the desire or the time.
I didn’t know you were talking about a current issue angel. Actually I didn’t even realize you were currently playing. I thought u bailed after the reset. My bad.
Welcome back :)
Don’t add eq or drachma to pre-existing mobs or they’ll have to be made tougher! Forget new areas and mobs. INCONCEIVABLE!
SlothMUD was built on new areas and mobs, so that might of been one of the dumbest comments Ive ever seen said in these forums.
Splork
Don’t add eq or drachma to pre-existing mobs or they’ll have to be made tougher! Forget new areas and mobs. INCONCEIVABLE!
[/quote:2ueyh1cb]
SlothMUD was built on new areas and mobs, so that might of been one of the dumbest comments Ive ever seen said in these forums.[/quote:2ueyh1cb]
Or as we used to say in the playground : Fight! Fight! Fight!
T
This is the same crap I got when I tried to moderate potion use/abuse.
It sucks when the players get crappy and sarcastic just because the admin finds something that needs rebalancing.
If 2 autoquests are the same drachma reward, then they should be of comparable difficulty. If they are drastically different, then we reserve the right to adjust them as necessary.
The same deal applies to the epics. As you guys get bigger and start hitting epics, there’s going to be some adjusting. It’s the nature of the beast. I’m sorry that we can’t anticipate exactly how every detail will play out before you do it. We have to observe and react.
Players really don’t have a lot to complain about. Splork has been very attentive to your needs regarding xp, leveling, availability of gold, on and on.
Yet people still are getting worked up because an autoquest mob got adjusted. It’s ridiculous.
I remember when I had to do some adjusting to potions and the entire Greedy clan gave me hell for weeks. Shimbo about quit over it. It’s not easy making tough decisions like that, but if no one paid attention to game balance, things would get exponentially out of whack over time.
I’m glad Chobbs is so involved with the mud. His enthusiasm has inspired me to be online more and do more building. Let’s not kill his spirit just yet.
It’s all fun and games till someone kills the elder titan at level 40.
Terminology like “needs rebalancing”, “broken”, and “fixed” in this context implies that we have an objective standard for what gameplay should look like, and you’re trying to make the game mesh with that standard. We’d all agree on extreme basics, for example that modifying the MUD to not crash where it currently does is a “fix”. Beyond that, I contend that a game is a standard unto itself. We don’t propose to balance the chess queen with the rook; we just play chess with knowledge of the difference.
Changing the game when players identify strong strategies or high-payoff mobs discourages players who enjoy sloth for its gamelike challenges. Those who enjoy sloth as a society more than a game welcome such changes.
[quote:1cqahqv4]Terminology like “needs rebalancing”, “broken”, and “fixed” in this context implies that we have an objective standard for what gameplay should look like, and you’re trying to make the game mesh with that standard. We’d all agree on extreme basics, for example that modifying the MUD to not crash where it currently does is a “fix”. Beyond that, I contend that a game is a standard unto itself. We don’t propose to balance the chess queen with the rook; we just play chess with knowledge of the difference.[/quote:1cqahqv4]
“Broken” and “fixed” can be interpreted in a fairly broad sense, but like you said, these two are generally agreed upon. However, it is the “balance” issue that seems to raise the most concerns.
I would contend that when things are changed, these instances of “balancing”, “broken” and “fixed”, that they are simply attempts to create or work towrds an ingame equilibrium, this standard that you speak of (hence the term “balancing”, or “rebalancing” if you wish). It’s true there is no objective standard, but until that elusive perfectly objective game engine is devised, there is little choice but to rely on subjective judgments which to implement changes.
I do not see how the balancing of a chess rook and queen is relevant. No one proposes they be “balanced”, largely because they already are. The game is not just a duel between a queen and a rook; the encompassing game system ensures that any perceived imbalance in their movesets be kept in check, or balanced if you will, by the inclusion of turns and other pieces. Should the queen suddenly become, say, impervious to capture or charm as many pawns as she can, then some voices might be heard.
[quote:1cqahqv4]Changing the game when players identify strong strategies or high-payoff mobs discourages players who enjoy sloth for its gamelike challenges. Those who enjoy sloth as a society more than a game welcome such changes.[/quote:1cqahqv4]
This is very true. But changes are not synonymous with ’nerfs’. I would contend that changes are meant to preserve the gamelike challenge, either by making things more difficult (for is that not part of the definition of challenge) or simply changing things to help keep an old game fresh.
These changes/rebalancing/fixes are largely to resolve some glaring issues, for instance, when someone can finish an entire aq chain without doing any of the intermediate steps. Who even knows how to get sin’s true name anymore? Or say, when you can cycle a mob that loads premium eq/high rewards but doesn’t really put up a fight. It becomes more of an exercise in waiting/seeing how many times you can regen and run back to him than any real challenge.
Also, a few of these changes/rebalancing/fixes are to increase low rewards for high effort. Why does no one ever complain about those rebalancings?
Chobbs!
wb atwell,where u been?:) well said anyways
These changes/rebalancing/fixes are largely to resolve some glaring issues, for instance, when someone can finish an entire aq chain without doing any of the intermediate steps. Who even knows how to get sin’s true name anymore? Or say, when you can cycle a mob that loads premium eq/high rewards but doesn’t really put up a fight. It becomes more of an exercise in waiting/seeing how many times you can regen and run back to him than any real challenge.
Also, a few of these changes/rebalancing/fixes are to increase low rewards for high effort. Why does no one ever complain about those rebalancings?
– change all the aq’s, coz we know the ropes of how to get 90% of it done, stare……
a games spose to keep progressing, coming up with new stuff n all.
this s4 doesnt look to be nothing much different other than the fact that u made us stronger just to hit the same old mobs,same old maps.. it would be dumb of us not to do it to our best potential.
same mobs, stronger chars,n so s4 is just beefing the old mobs up so we take longer time to redo all that we’ve done b4?
u talk about challenge, this is wat ur proposing arent u? just beef up mobs from s3,make us stronger,longer time to lvl = s4?
so lessay one find day,ill get a 4x40 n solo fallon,tiamat,all the boring crap.
ur gonna beef them up as well? go ahead,do it now why wait till we start doing it b4 u change them
You brutally gut a purple dragon!
A purple dragon looks down in terror as a lone, sharp scale falls to the ground!
A purple dragon is dead! R.I.P.
You receive 0 experience points as your share.
You gain 0 experience for leadership!
Your conscience has been bothering you a bit.
Tuk receives 0 experience points.
Toxis receives 0 experience points.
Yoshimi receives 0 experience points.
Zeraz receives 0 experience points.
Cizin receives 0 experience points.
Total exp for kill is 0.
gjob, 0 xp too now?
Terminology like “needs rebalancing”, “broken”, and “fixed” in this context implies that we have an objective standard for what gameplay should look like, and you’re trying to make the game mesh with that standard. We’d all agree on extreme basics, for example that modifying the MUD to not crash where it currently does is a “fix”. Beyond that, I contend that a game is a standard unto itself. We don’t propose to balance the chess queen with the rook; we just play chess with knowledge of the difference.
Changing the game when players identify strong strategies or high-payoff mobs discourages players who enjoy sloth for its gamelike challenges. Those who enjoy sloth as a society more than a game welcome such changes.[/quote:2nok61m8]
I can agree with this for the most part. I don’t want to give the impression that we’re constantly spying on you guys looking for stuff to nerf.
This change was one of a larger subset of changes to the autoquest system. A lot of quests are being added as well. So the total available drachma is being increased, even if a few are being reduced or made harder. It is a net positive.